City Council Meeting Minutes - 4/5/2010
COMMON COUNCIL
APRIL 5, 2010 7:00 P.M.
THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE WAS GIVEN BY EVERYONE IN ATTENDANCE.
PRAYER WAS GIVEN BY PASTOR DENNIS KINSER, NEW CASTLE CHURCH OF CHRIST.
MAYOR SMALL OPENED THE MEETING OF THE COMMON COUNCIL.
ROLL CALL:
SANDY YORK PRESENT
JAMES KIDD PRESENT
MARY MALONE PRESENT
MARK KOGER ABSENT
VAUGHN REID PRESENT
RICHARD HAHN ABSENT
MINUTES WERE APPROVED AS PRESENTED.
PRESIDENT YORK MOVED TO PASS THIS ORDINANCE ON SECOND READING. COUNCILADY GOODMAN: SECOND ROLL CALL VOTE: FIVE VOTES AYE. PASSED AND ORDERED.
ATTORNEY COPENHAVER ANNOUNCED THAT THIS WAS PUBLIC HEARING ON ORDINANCE #3595 AND ANYONE WISHING TO SPEAK COULD DO SO AT THIS TIME.
TONY HOARD, BROWN STREET, SAID THAT ALL OF THESE LOTS BEHIND HIS PROPERTY WAS NOT DEVELOPED. HE SAID HE MAINTAINS THIS PROPERTY AND HAS FOR THE LAST FOUR YEARS. HE SAID THERE WAS NOTHING BACK THERE AND THEY DIDN'T WANT TO PUT ANYTHING THERE.
ATTORNEY COPENHAVER ASKED MR. HOARD IF HE AND HIS NEIGHBOR WHO WOULD SHARE THIS LAND, AGREE THAT THE CITY IS RESERVING THE RIGHT IF WE EVER NEED TO PUT UTILITIES DOWN THERE, A SEWER LINE OR WATER LINE THAT WE CAN DO IT WITHOUT ANY COMPENSATION. HE SAID I DID EXPLAIN THAT TO YOU?
MR. HOARD SAID YES. HE SAID THAT WAS NOT A PROBLEM. THERE IS A SEWER LINE THERE NOW.
RANDY DAVIS, SPRING STREET, ASKED ABOUT THE SIZE OF THE PROPERTY IN QUESTION.
ATTORNEY COPENHAVER SAID YES. EACH WILL GET HALF.
PRESIDENT YORK MOVED TO PASS ORDINANCE #3595, SECOND READING BY TITLE ONLY.
COUNCILADY MALONE: SECOND ROLL CALL VOTE: FIVE VOTES AYE. PASSED AND ORDERED.
PRESIDENT YORK MOVED TO PASS THIS ORDINANCE ON THIRD READING.
COUNCILMAN KIDD: SECOND ROLL CALL VOTE: FIVE VOTES AYE. PASSED AND ORDERED.
PRESIDENT YORK MOVED TO PASS THIS ORDINANCE ON SECOND READING.
COUNCILADY GOODMAN: SECOND ROLL CALL VOTE: FIVE VOTES AYE. PASSED AND ORDERED.
COUNCIL REPORTS: NONE
PUBLIC:
MAYOR SMALL SAID HE WAS OPENING THE FLOOR TO THE PUBLIC.
COUNCILMAN REID SAID WE DON'T HAVE AN ORDINANCE YET, DISCUSSING THE TRASH SITUATION AND THE CHARGE OF FEES. HE, COUNCILMAN REID, MADE THE MOTION TO SUSPEND OUR CURRENT RULES OF PUBLIC COMMENT AND PROHIBIT PUBLIC COMMENT ON THE TRASH SITUATION UNTIL WE ACTUALLY HAVE AN ORDINANCE THAT IS ON THE COUNCIL AGENDA. PRESIDENT YORK: SECOND
DISCUSSION: MARY LOGAN, 119 N. 18TH ST., SAID SHE UNDERSTANDS THAT WE DON'T HAVE A TRASH ORDINANCE YET, BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT THE TRASH PICK UP. A LOT OF UNANSWERED QUESTIONS SUCH AS HOW MUCH MONEY IT HAS SAVED THE CITY, QUESTIONS FROM THE LAST COUNCIL MEETING THAT SHOULD BE ADDRESSED. COMMENTS MADE BY MAYOR SMALL. SHE SAID SHE WANTED TO LET THE COUNCIL KNOW THAT THIS IS A PUBLIC MEETING AND THE CITIZENS HAVE THE RIGHT TO BRING THEIR CONCERNS TO THE ADMINISTRATION AND COUNCIL.
MAYOR SMALL SAID THEY COULD SET UP ANOTHER MEETING %u2026%u2026%u2026%u2026%u2026%u2026%u2026
MAYOR SMALL SAID YOU DIDN'T LIKE THE FIGURES THAT I GAVE YOU, WHY GIVE YOU MORE?
MRS. LOGAN SAID SHE DIDN'T LIKE HIS FIGU7RES BECAUSE THEY DON'T ADD UP. SHE SAID SHE TRIED TO SHOW HIM LAST WEEK.
MAYOR SMALL SAID TO MRS. LOGAN, IF YOU NEED HELP WITH YOUR SPREAD SHEET, MRS. CUPP WILL SHOW YOU HOW TO DO IT.
MRS. LOGAN SAID THAT WAS UNCALLED FOR. SHE SAID SHE HAD AN ACCOUNTANT THAT HELPED WITH HER SPREAD SHEET. SHE SAID SHE GOT THE FIGURES FROM THE MAYOR AND THE CITY CLERK'S OFFICE. SHE SAID SHE KNEW HOW TO DO A SPREAD SHEET. SHE SAID SHE DID NOT INSULT HIS SPREAD SHEET AND SHE DID NOT APPRECIATE HIM INSULTING HERS. SHE SAID HERS WAS AS ACCURATE AS HIS. SHE SAID THIS IS A PUBLIC FORUM AND THE PUBLIC HAS THE RIGHT TO SPEAK ABOUT WHATEVER CONCERNS THEY HAVE. WHETHER IT BE TRASH, SEWER OR WHATEVER.
PRESIDENT YORK SAID WE ARE GOING TO GIVE YOU FOLKS PLENTY OF TIME BUT RIGHT NOW WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE SOMETHING THAT WE WILL BE ABLE TO TALK ABOUT. WE ARE STILL WORKING ON THE SAME DATA%u2026%u2026%u2026%u2026..
MRS. LOGAN SAID TO PRESIDENT YORK, MAYOR SMALL SAID AT THE LAST MEETING THAT WE WERE GOING TO HAVE 2 OR 3 PEOPLE TO RUN THIS TRASH PICK UP. WE ARE GOING TO HAVE FIVE TRUCKS, HOW ARE YOU GOING TO RUN THE TRASH ROUTES WITH 2 OR 3 PEOPLE?
COUNCILMAN REID SAID OBVIOUSLY, TEMPERS ON BOTH SIDES IS AN ISSUE. THIS IS A VERY CONTROVERSIAL FOR NEW CASTLE. SOMETHING VERY IMPORTANT. IF AND WHEN WE START CHARGING FOR TRASH, THAT WE TRY TO DO IT RIGHT. TWO THINGS WILL HAPPEN. ONE, WE KNOW THERE HAVE BEEN ISSUES WITH THE TRASH AND DO IT IN A WAY THAT IS GOING TO BE THE CHEAPEST FOR THE CITIZENS. WE AS A COUNCIL CAN NOT SIT BACK AND LOOK AT THE DATA AND INFORMATION THAT WE HAVE BEEN GIVEN BOTH FROM OUR OWN RESEARCH AND RESEARCH FROM THE ADMINISTRATION. AT EVERY MEETING, WE ARE GETTING BADGERED AND BEAT OVER THE HEAD BECAUSE EVERYONE'S FEELINGS AND FRUSTRATIONS ARE RUNNING HIGH. YOU OR THE MAYOR ISN'T HELPING DO OUR JOBS. WE MUST MAKE THE BEST DECISION FOR THE CITIZENS IN RELATIONS TO THE TRASH SITUATION AND OTHERS. WE DON'T HAVE AN ORDINANCE RIGHT NOW, WE ARE STILL DOING RESEARCH, SO SOME OF THE THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN SAID SO FAR, HAVE COME ABOUT BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE SNAPPING THINGS OFF THE CUFF AND WE ARE GUILTY OF IT FROM TIME TO TIME, WITHOUT HAVING ENOUGH RESEARCH AND DONE ENOUGH HOMEWORK, GETTING ALL OUR FACTS AND COMING TO A FINAL CONCLUSION. THE COUNCIL HAS TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT BECAUSE IT COULD MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN THE 3, 4, OR 5 DOLLARS A MONTH IN EVERYBODY'S TRASH BILL. IF AND WHEN WE ACTUALLY END UP WITH A TRASH ORDINANCE. HE SAID THAT IS WHY HE MADE THAT MOTION. WE ARE STILL GOING TO HAVE TIME FOR EVERYBODY TO HAVE PUBLIC COMMENTS AND PLENTY OF TIME FOR PUBLIC DISCUSSION, ONCE WE HAVE AN ACTUAL ORDINANCE. WE HAVE TO GET OUR FACTS TOGETHER SO WE CAN ANALYZE IT AND COME TOGETHER TO DISCUSS IT. IT IS NOT PRODUCTIVE FOR YOU OR THE COUNCIL TO KEEP GOING OVER THE SAME QUESTIONS EVERY WEEK AND DOES NOTHING BUT GETS EVERYBODY'S TEMPERS ALL FLARED UP AND IT DOESN'T HELP ANYBODY.
MRS. LOGAN SAID SHE AGREED WITH THAT BUT SHE ALSO KNEW, MEETING WITH MAYOR SMALL, HE SAID IN OUR MEETING THAT HE WAS GOING TO BUY A LIGHTNING TRUCK AND ANOTHER ONE ARMED TRUCK AND 2,000 MORE TOTERS. THAT WILL MAKE OUR COST AS TAX PAYERS GO UP FROM ONE MILLION TWENTY THREE THOUSAND OR HOWEVER MUCH IT WAS TO ALMOST TWO MILLION DOLLARS, IF WE PURCHASE THE OTHER TRUCKS. THIS IS FROM YOUR SHEETS MAYOR SMALL. NOTHING I INVENTED. HER CONCERN WAS, ARE WE GOING TO CONTINUE TO PUT OUR CITIZENS INTO MORE DEBT WHEN WE KNOW AS CITIZENS, YOU KNOW AS OUR LEADERS, WE ARE GOING TO FACE FURTHER CUTS IN THE FUTURE. PROPERTY TAXES ARE GOING DOWN. HER CONCERN WAS IS THE BURDEN GOING TO BE SO GREAT, AND MAYOR SMALL SAID WE AREN'T PAYING IT ALL AT ONCE, BUT MAYOR SMALL SAID THE PACKERS WERE OUTDATED AND NEEDED TO BE REPLACED. THOSE PACKERS ARE 8 OR 9 YEARS OLD. WHEN WE ARE DONE FOR THESE NEW TRUCKS, THEY ARE GOING TO BE 7 YEARS OLD. THAT IS HER CONCERN. THEY WILL BE OBSOLETE.
COUNCILMAN REID SAID THAT THEY KNEW AND THAT IS SOMETHING THEY ARE WORKING ON AND LOOKING AT. HE SAID HE UNDERSTOOD HER CONCERN BUT THE COUNCIL IS WELL AWARE OF WHAT SOME OF THOSE ISSUES ARE. WE ARE WORKING TO MAKE THE BEST DECISION.
MRS. LOGAN SAID HER OTHER CONCERN WAS IF WE OUT SOURCE IT, HOW MUCH MORE IS OUR CITY SERVICES GOING TO SUFFER. SHE SAID SHE WOULD RATHER PAY $20.00 AND HAVE THE PEOPLE THAT GIVE TO OUR COMMUNITY BACK TO WORK. WHY GIVE $10.00 OR $15.00 A MONTH FOR A TRUCK THAT HAS TO MAKE TWO TRIPS UP AND DOWN THE STREET.
MAYOR SMALL MADE THE STATEMENT THAT RATHER IT IS THE ISSUE SEEMS TO BE IF IT IS COST EFFECTIVE TO AUTOMATE. OUR FIGURES SHOW THAT WE ARE SAVING OVER A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS A YEAR BY AUTOMATION. EVEN IF WE BROKE EVEN, EVEN IF IT WAS A WASH, HE SAID HE WOULD SAY THEY DID THE RIGHT THING. IN THE LAST THREE YEARS, THERE HAVE BEEN THIRTEEN INJURIES THAT WERE WORK RELATED. THE HEALTH AND WELFARE OF OUR WORKERS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING AS LONG AS WE DO HAVE THIS AUTOMATION, THEY ARE PROTECTED FROM INJURIES LIKE THAT. WE HAVE HAD VERY EMOTIONAL DISCUSSIONS ABOUT A YEAR AGO, HOW BAD IT WAS, HOW HARD IT WAS, HOW THE MEN WERE GETTING INJURED ON THE BACK OF THE PACKERS, THIS IS NOT HAPPENING NOW WITH OUR AUTO MATED TRUCKS.
DONNA RAGAN, 1524 A AVENUE, MADE COMMENT THAT THESE ARE TRYING TIMES AND WE DO HAVE TO MAKE A LOT OF DECISIONS MAYOR SMALL AND COUNCIL MEMBERS, WE HAVE MADE SACRIFICES ALSO. TO KEEP A JOB WE HAVE GIVEN UP RAISES AND INSURANCE. SHE SAID SHE HAS LIVED IN NEW CASTLE ALL OF HER LIFE AND NEVER SEEN IT THIS BAD. SHE SAID SHE WASN'T POINTING FINGERS AT ANYONE PERSON BECAUSE WE ARE IN A RECESSION. WE NEED TO GET OUR HEADS OUT OF THE SAND, RATHER PEOPLE NEED PROMOTIONS OR NOT, THIS IS NOT THE TIME. PEOPLE NEED JOBS. IF WE AREN'T CAREFUL, THE ONLY PEOPLE LEFT IN THIS TOWN IS PEOPLE THAT CAN'T GET RID OF THEIR HOMES, THEY ARE STUCK AND SHE WAS ONE OF THEM AND WOULD MOVE OUT TOMORROW IF SHE COULD. SHE HATED TO SAY THAT BECAUSE SHE WAS ALWAYS PROUD OF NEW CASTLE. SHE DIDN'T AGREE WITH ANY ONE TAKING HOME CITY VEHICLES. SHE SAID LIKE THE POLICE, SHE APPRECIATED WHAT THEY DO BUT THEY CHOSE THAT JOB AND SHOULD DRIVE THEIR OWN VEHICLES TO AND FROM WORK AND SHOPPING.
NORMA DISHMAN, 645 S. 11TH ST., SAID IT HAD BEEN HER EXPERIENCE EVER SINCE SHE STARTED COMING TO COUNCIL MEETINGS, ONCE AN ORDINANCE IS WRITTEN, IT IS READ AND PASSED ON FIRST READING, SECOND READING IS GENERALLY THE DISCUSSION, THE THIRD READING YOU GET NO DISCUSSION AND IT GETS PASSED. A LOT OF TIMES ON THE SECOND READING, PEOPLE THAT SHOULD BE HERE AND TALK, ARE NOT HERE. SHE ASKED THE COUNCIL THAT WHEN THEY HAVE THE ORDINANCE ABOUT TRASH, HAVE AT LEAST TWO, SO PEOPLE CAN COME TO THEM. NOT JUST ONE BUT TWO. SHE SOME OF THE ELDERLY PEOPLE WERE SCARED BECAUSE OF THE THREAT OF LIENS BEING PUT ON A HOUSE IF THE FEES WERE NOT PAID.
COUNCILMAN REID SAID IN THIS SITUATION, WE ARE NOT PROHIBITING PUBLIC COMMENTS ONCE WE HAVE AN ORDINANCE. THE DISCUSSION IS ABOUT WHAT MAY OR MAY NOT HAPPEN WITH THE TRASH FEE BEFORE WE HAVE AN ORDINANCE. THE COMMENTS ARE HEATED AND FRUSTRATING ENOUGH ON BOTH SIDES. ONCE THE COUNCIL HAS THEIR FACTS TOGETHER. UNTIL THAT TIME, THERE IS NO REASON TO GET HYSTERICAL ABOUT IT BEFORE THE MEETING. HE SAID THAT IS WHY HE MADE THE MOTION. CALM THINGS DOWN A LITTLE. WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO COME UP WITH A GOOD DECISION AND TO DO THAT, WE NEED TIME TO GET ALL OF OUR INFORMATION.
MRS. DISHMAN SAID SHE WAS ASKING THE COUNCIL TO GIVE TWO MEETINGS SO
EVERYONE CAN BE HEARD.
PRESIDENT YORK SAID AS PRESIDENT OF THE COUNCIL, SHE GAVE HER WORD THAT ADEQUATE TIME WOULD BE GIVEN.
MAYOR SMALL SAID THAT THE PUBLIC CAN SPEAK AT ALL THREE MEETINGS.
HE SAID WITH THE TRASH ORDINANCE, THERE WILL BE A FOURTH OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK.
COUNCILMAN KIDD SAID HE FELT VERY UNCOMFORTABLE ASKING PEOPLE NOT TO SPEAK REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE SUBJECT IS. HE SAID HE WAS NOT SUPPORTING THE MOTION.
ROLL CALL VOTE: FOUR VOTES AYE. ONE VOTE (KIDD) NAY MOTION PASSED.
MAYOR SMALL WELCOMED FORMER MAYOR SHERMAN BOLES AND WIFE KATHY TO THE MEETING.
PRESIDENT YORK MOVED TO ADJOURN.
